November 20, 2019, 01:10:10 PM

Author Topic: Monkey site down for maintenance or is it the end?  (Read 1726 times)

Offline Naughty Alien

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Re: Monkey site down for maintenance or is it the end?
« Reply #15 on: August 11, 2019, 02:44:12 AM »
..he attac..
..he protec..


but most importantly..


he did web site smacc..

Offline Qube

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Re: Monkey site down for maintenance or is it the end?
« Reply #16 on: August 11, 2019, 04:04:45 AM »
Well I think this pretty much confirms the end of http://monkeycoder.co.nz and the community - Over at Discord :

Quote
marksibly

I've tweaked the itch.io page a bit and plan to redirect monkeycoder.co.nz to it ASAP:

https://blitzresearch.itch.io/monkey2

This will do as a homepage for now, but I would like to get github pages going - @Vidiot_X would you be into helping me with this? Anyone else? I assume people make PRs and I merge them? Will need to take a closer look...

In general though I only want to have to deal with static sites in future. Any discussions should be taking place here or on a slack channel or something. I'm through with hosting 'forums' etc.

So there you have it...
Until the next time...

Offline iWasAdam

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Re: Monkey site down for maintenance or is it the end?
« Reply #17 on: August 11, 2019, 07:14:41 AM »
Hmmm. as one of (the very) few users I feel I can at least add some overview:
The monkey2 language was one of the best I've used, but there is soo much missing. the core concepts (and code) are all there, but the details are missing:
E.G.
color having basic red yellow, blue and a few others but nothing more and no way to actually see without coding - these were (eventually) a bit but even then only a few additions and some later ones for PBR plus some appalling spelling!

2d graphics primitives being based on 3d, but stopping short of making use of what 3d offers: shaders, Also just basic shapes provided, and no way to extend them yourself without going into the core code.
E.G.
DrawRect makes a filled box, but no way to draw just the frame. the same for DrawCircle. Yep you could code one up, but it SHOULD have been there as part of the core
To EXTEND a CLASS all the stuff you need access to is PRIVATE - all the vertex code and other stuff you need to extend to add functions

Help files. Just don't get me started on help files. there is basic help but most of it is either (terrible is too nice a word) absolutely appalling or completely missing. nothing to tell you information, nothing to help you and no examples

But in saying all of that the language itself is really nice to use and super stable - BlitzMax had some very odd things going on inside which made any apps unstable. not sure why or what but there was just something not quite right in BlitzMax.

My only beef was his treatment of users, particularly anyone who had the grillocks to make suggestions or improvements.
He publicly used my software to market BlitzMax and then deliberately altered Monkey2 code to prevent me from releasing stuff when I pointed out how things could be improved!

He was (at best) abrasive to the whole community. His treatment of the BlitzMax users in the end was shameful.

I will continue t use MX2 until it becomes obsolete, and would advise anyone to NOT use ANY new project with his name attatched.

RIP Monkey2
Stupid name
Cut down too soon


Offline Kris

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Re: Monkey site down for maintenance or is it the end?
« Reply #18 on: August 11, 2019, 01:22:11 PM »
My only beef was his treatment of users, particularly anyone who had the grillocks to make suggestions or improvements.
He publicly used my software to market BlitzMax and then deliberately altered Monkey2 code to prevent me from releasing stuff when I pointed out how things could be improved!

Could you tell more about this? What software of yours did he use and how did he alter the Monkey2 code?

Offline iWasAdam

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Re: Monkey site down for maintenance or is it the end?
« Reply #19 on: August 11, 2019, 02:25:07 PM »
software was VJO Wave. and used screenshots and other shots in the marketing of BlitzMax. Basically promoting the language as brilliant examples of what could be done. There was no request by Mark about if it could be used, etc. But I was not too bothered as it showed he trusted VJO Wave as a good example...

Monkey2 module MojoX was originally not a module, but was part of the Ted Editor. I was in touch directly with Mark about MojoX and how it functioned, he was not happy with MojoX and said it should be restarted from scratch. I was (very publicly) working on an enhanced version of Ted and it was being well received by the community.
What was interesting was I released a version of the Editor with a new UI system that showed enhanced functions for audio. Mark liked what he saw and With the next update MojoX was suddenly a module and deeply integrated (for no actual reason) or warning - thus completely breaking any work being done with the old system and also breaking the new version of the Ted editor. There was no need for it to be done in this way - this was purely deliberate on Marks' side and showed a very petty and nasty side of things. It was talked about briefly, but Marks response was basically "tough"!



Offline GfK

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Re: Monkey site down for maintenance or is it the end?
« Reply #20 on: August 11, 2019, 02:54:39 PM »
*looks up from Unity*

*rolls eyes*

*goes back to Unity*
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Offline Kris

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Re: Monkey site down for maintenance or is it the end?
« Reply #21 on: August 11, 2019, 04:20:00 PM »
Well, those don't sound too good Adam. Sorry for the undeserved faith of your editor. That whole thing sucks big time.

Offline iWasAdam

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Re: Monkey site down for maintenance or is it the end?
« Reply #22 on: August 11, 2019, 08:06:57 PM »
Thanks, the editor development was continued, extended and is very well used by me to this day... just compiled on the original version of the language 😍

Offline Dabz

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Re: Monkey site down for maintenance or is it the end?
« Reply #23 on: August 11, 2019, 09:24:19 PM »
Quote
*looks up from Unity*

*rolls eyes*

*goes back to Unity*

Hey up Dave, hows it keeping? Hope all is well! :)

Here, I've tried Unity, bought a book and everything (Sams Teach Yourself Unity Game Development 2018), and even though I worked through it, understood it, even managed to get a VR app up on my Oculus Go, I dunno, I'm still a stubborn fart and just prefer the old way! :P

Not that I do much, but hey, I guess I'm just stuck in the old school mindset! ;)

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Offline Kryzon

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Re: Monkey site down for maintenance or is it the end?
« Reply #24 on: August 11, 2019, 09:57:26 PM »
The cool thing about BMax was that you could very well use it to make generic desktop software, not just games.

Offline Qube

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Re: Monkey site down for maintenance or is it the end?
« Reply #25 on: August 12, 2019, 01:33:11 AM »
@iWasAdam - I vaguely remember all that :o not great to do such a thing and you should have been told upfront.

Quote from: Dabz
Here, I've tried Unity, bought a book and everything (Sams Teach Yourself Unity Game Development 2018), and even though I worked through it, understood it, even managed to get a VR app up on my Oculus Go, I dunno, I'm still a stubborn fart and just prefer the old way! :P
I kinda like the direction Unity is heading in and it's finally getting some decent 2D updates and pushing towards smaller and faster exe's. It's a beast to learn with a lot of functionality but it's pretty easy to get into the basics.

But, like you, I do prefer the old school way of doing things although I do like to dabble with Unity.
Until the next time...

Offline iWasAdam

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Re: Monkey site down for maintenance or is it the end?
« Reply #26 on: August 12, 2019, 08:59:24 AM »
Quote
I vaguely remember all that :o not great to do such a thing and you should have been told upfront.
Yep. I learnt a thing or two at that point!  >:(

Still, it's not all bad. It made me take the whole thing apart and find out what to do to fix things. But i would have loved to folded all the results back into the source, but again Mark took (i think it was over a year) to add a couple of the suggested colors!

Me: i've got a very nice editor, all the dev stuff I wanted (visual colour palettes, profiling, binary code view, etc). What has Mark got? Oh yep. he just nuked the community and language!  :-* :)) 8)

Hmm. more game design methinks...

Offline GfK

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Re: Monkey site down for maintenance or is it the end?
« Reply #27 on: August 12, 2019, 12:20:19 PM »
Hey up Dave, hows it keeping? Hope all is well! :)
Hello!

Pretty good at the min! Rough start to the year, mind.  Mum died in January, then the dog got sick and had to be put to sleep in March.  So I was all a bit "Fuck you, 2019" for a while there.  Decided to focus on getting fit again and managed to lose over 30lb in the last ten weeks.  So, plodding on.  Mountain bike doesn't know what's hit it. :D

Quote
Here, I've tried Unity, bought a book and everything (Sams Teach Yourself Unity Game Development 2018), and even though I worked through it, understood it, even managed to get a VR app up on my Oculus Go, I dunno, I'm still a stubborn fart and just prefer the old way! :P
I was the same at first, way back in Unity 3.  Then one of the many precursors to Monkey2's downfall prompted me to give Unity another crack and work through some online tutorials that really helped it all to click.  All I can say is the more you do it, the more "normal" it gets.  Blitzmax code is completely alien to me now.

This "Release, update, abandon" cycle of Blitz Research really irked me.  Especially when it happened to Blitzmax after all the others had gone the same way and I'm glad I made the decision to quit when I did.  Tried Monkey, briefly, but it was an ordeal.  Way too much faff.
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Offline Dabz

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Re: Monkey site down for maintenance or is it the end?
« Reply #28 on: August 12, 2019, 02:32:34 PM »
Quote
Pretty good at the min! Rough start to the year, mind.  Mum died in January, then the dog got sick and had to be put to sleep in March.  So I was all a bit "Fuck you, 2019" for a while there.  Decided to focus on getting fit again and managed to lose over 30lb in the last ten weeks.  So, plodding on.  Mountain bike doesn't know what's hit it. :D

So sorry to hear about your mam and doggle matey, your head must of been spinning! :(

Wow, shifted 2 and a bit stone, that takes some doing mind, so well done for that, I need to drop a bit myself really, not as half as active as I was and its coming to the point where I've got enough chins to open my own china town! :P

Anyway, good to hear your still kicking and everything is settled down! ;)

Dabz
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Offline Dabz

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Re: Monkey site down for maintenance or is it the end?
« Reply #29 on: August 12, 2019, 02:51:55 PM »
Wrong thread

Dabz
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