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Author Topic: Blitz3D - what do you like, what not?  (Read 6032 times)

Offline Xaron

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Blitz3D - what do you like, what not?
« on: September 16, 2017, 09:37:06 AM »
I've asked almost the same question for BlitzMax, so I'd like to know what you liked most about BB3D and where would you see room for improvement, both language wise and features?

Personally I hated the way types where accessed with type\x, where I would had preferred type.x

I'm asking because Mike and I started something like BB3D (but cross platform), so... Do you actually still see the need of kind of an easy accessable language (non oop)?

Thanks!

Offline Steve Elliott

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Re: Blitz3D - what do you like, what not?
« Reply #1 on: September 16, 2017, 09:56:09 AM »
Personally I always felt the Blitz BASIC syntax old-fashioned so never really used it.  Yet to turn out something like C++/Java would be over-kill for such a product.  It's a tricky fine line to tread.

The 3D side of things was very simple and effective.
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Offline RonTek

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Re: Blitz3D - what do you like, what not?
« Reply #2 on: September 16, 2017, 10:08:21 AM »
I personally think the OpenB3D guys (markcwm and angros47) already got this covered if they can pull the emscripten and android target.

But then again this does sound interesting Martin.. what do you have in mind? ThinBasic or from scratch?  ;D

If we're talking about pure BB3D stuff then there's also kfprimm's Blitz3D NG project which is now a few months inactive.

Offline sphinx

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Re: Blitz3D - what do you like, what not?
« Reply #3 on: September 16, 2017, 10:37:11 AM »
Although I am a 2D guy but was one the first who bought Blitz3D, I liked the idea it has a printed (wired!) manual.
I liked the easy to remember and consistent keywords, the good performance back then when compared to say Dark Basic!

How ironic that Dark Basic guys are doing great right now, 'Someone' should have been in their place and even better.

I hated the \ to access type fields too and hate the fact that it is based on DX7 for more than a decade now!
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Offline RonTek

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Re: Blitz3D - what do you like, what not?
« Reply #4 on: September 16, 2017, 10:49:19 AM »
Although I am a 2D guy but was one the first who bought Blitz3D, I liked the idea it has a printed (wired!) manual.
I liked the easy to remember and consistent keywords, the good performance back then when compared to say Dark Basic!

How ironic that Dark Basic guys are doing great right now, 'Someone' should have been in their place and even better.

I hated the \ to access type fields too and hate the fact that it is based on DX7 for more than a decade now!

I have used both and with Blitz3D, you can overcome your DX7 dilemma by using wrappers. ;) I find the irrlicht one of the best so far. With DarkBasic and AGK, the problem is the language when it gets bigger, graphic performance is way better of course with DX9 or OpenGL (agk).

Offline MikeHart

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Re: Blitz3D - what do you like, what not?
« Reply #5 on: September 16, 2017, 11:28:28 AM »
I personally think the OpenB3D guys (markcwm and angros47) already got this covered if they can pull the emscripten and android target.

But then again this does sound interesting Martin.. what do you have in mind? ThinBasic or from scratch?  ;D

If we're talking about pure BB3D stuff then there's also kfprimm's Blitz3D NG project which is now a few months inactive.

It is something from scratch. The goal is to create a game development tool/language, where you don't have to deal with the underlying technology. In the same spirit of AGK/Blitz3D. No need to install this sdk, that sdk. Just code your game and press run or create a final executable to release. The focus is 3D but you will be able to use 2D technics as well.
With the success of AGK, we believe that there is still a market for BASIC languages that are easy to code and have a powerful API.


The projects you mentioned are all great and I hope they take off.


And if you wonder about Cerberus X. It is and will still be there and has our support. That won't change. This project is totally unrelated to Monkey/Cerberus.


 

Offline Steve Elliott

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Re: Blitz3D - what do you like, what not?
« Reply #6 on: September 16, 2017, 11:33:28 AM »
What is the graphics engine written in Mike?
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Offline MikeHart

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Re: Blitz3D - what do you like, what not?
« Reply #7 on: September 16, 2017, 11:34:36 AM »
C++.  ;)  By from scratch I ment we create all the tools from scratch. IDE, Parser/Compiler, etc.


Of course we utilize libraries that are available for doing things.

Offline Steve Elliott

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Re: Blitz3D - what do you like, what not?
« Reply #8 on: September 16, 2017, 11:36:22 AM »
C++ only does logic lol  :P
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Offline MikeHart

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Re: Blitz3D - what do you like, what not?
« Reply #9 on: September 16, 2017, 11:38:15 AM »
C++ only does logic lol  :P


Ah you ment which graphics engine we will utilize? Last tests where done with Irrlicht. So it can be DX or OpenGL I think.

Offline RonTek

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Re: Blitz3D - what do you like, what not?
« Reply #10 on: September 16, 2017, 11:53:46 AM »
Last tests where done with Irrlicht. So it can be DX or OpenGL I think.

Good choice. It also supports software renderer (BurningsVideo) and null device which I think is for headless.

Offline Steve Elliott

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Re: Blitz3D - what do you like, what not?
« Reply #11 on: September 16, 2017, 11:55:05 AM »
Cool  ;D
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Offline dawlane

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Re: Blitz3D - what do you like, what not?
« Reply #12 on: September 16, 2017, 01:33:42 PM »
Well I hated the reverse solidius for types and the use of short hand symbols for data types. And as for Irrlicht, the last time I looked there was no official iOS and Android support. But then even when such engines claim to support multiple devices the documentation is either out of date or not complete.

Edit: Ideally it's best not to tie yourself down to the one SDK as with Blitz3D did with DX7.

Offline Xaron

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Re: Blitz3D - what do you like, what not?
« Reply #13 on: September 16, 2017, 02:07:47 PM »
@RonTek: Yeah I've heard about OpenB3D but never looked at it actually. Will do so!

It will be from scratch like Mike said, it will use Irrlicht as renderer engine plus some other stuff for physics, sound and so on. I've used Irrlicht for ages now and it's in a pretty good shape. Android and iOS are working as well but the team has changed. It's used by quite some professionals as well so I think it still had a bright future. Sure, there is no (official) DX11/12 renderer yet but I'm fine with that.

@sphinx: Haha oh well a printed manual. Yeah, those were the days. I work for a company doing medical devices which goes into the hundred of thousands dollars per system and even there is often no printed manual anymore. Strange times.

@dawlane: yeah agreed. Using Irrlicht means there are tons of different render pathes.

So rendering aside: It should be an easy to use tool, in terms of language is there anything which should be in? We want to do it that way, the AGK guys did it, so a Basic language which is interpreted for debug sessions BUT compiled (here's the difference to AGK) for creating executables plus the obvious C++ API stuff.

Offline MagosDomina

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Re: Blitz3D - what do you like, what not?
« Reply #14 on: September 18, 2017, 11:58:59 PM »
The only real thing I disliked about Blitz3d was the stock IDE. It should almost never be used when Ideal is so superior. Other than the fact it stopped being developed by Mark (a true successor never emerged) I only have a few nitpicks.
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